The Beatles

[BeatlesFan]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

 

[Foxhound]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

This may answer some Pete Best questions...

Interesting. What's also interesting is that, according to Wikipedia, Ringo was not Brian Epsteins' first choice to replace Pete!

The vacant drummer position in The Beatles was initially offered by manager Brian Epstein to Johnny Hutchinson of The Big Three, whom he also managed. Hutchinson turned down the job, saying "Pete Best is a very good friend of mine. I couldn't do the dirty on him". Hutchinson did agree to fill in three bookings until second choice Ringo Starr could join. Starr took Best's place in the band.

 

[BeatlesFan]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

Interesting. One thing the brief video does not address is why George Martin did not like Pete Best's drumming when the fans of the Beatles in the Liverpool clubs seemed to dote upon it.

Here's an interview with Klaus Voorman that gives an inside look at Liverpool's Merseybeat scene....

Gary James' Interview With Klaus Voormann

Talk about being in the right place at the right time - that describes Klaus Voormann.

He was walking down the street in Hamburg, Germany and heard music coming out of the Kaiserkeller Club. He heard and saw a group called Rory Storm and The Hurricanes, whose drummer was none other than Ringo Starr. The next group up was called The Beatles. To make a long story short, Klaus Voormann became friends with The Beatles. He went on to design the album cover of "Revolver". He played bass on the solo albums of John, George and Ringo. He also played bass on albums by Harry Nilsson, Carly Simon and Lou Reed to name just a few. He was a member of Manfred Mann.

Q - Were The Beatles moving around onstage?

A - Well, you see, Rory Storm and The Hurricanes, that was the band Ringo was playing in, they were making sort of like a show band thing where they did move steps to the side and all that, but not wild acts. People always think it was a concert. Those are not concerts. It's a dance hall, where people wanted to dance. They didn't want to dance just to records in those days. They wanted to actually have a band. So the band was mainly just standing there, like The Beatles were later standing there onstage singing. Of course the announcements were much more provoking and dirty, because in those days they didn't have to check every word they were saying.

Q - I ask because in his book Lennon Remembers, John Lennon stated that after Hamburg, they had to clean up their act. I guess John would come onstage with a toilet seat around his neck.

A - Yeah. They were crazy. In general they were just excited about the music. George was 17, so...

Q - On that same day, you heard Rory Storm and The Hurricanes with Ringo.

A - The first band I heard was The Beatles, through the window. And since I got my guts together to go in there, that's when Rory Storm and The Hurricanes were onstage. So, I saw Ringo first, with Rory Storm and The Hurricanes and then I was The Beatles.

Q - Did Ringo stand out in that band?

A - Very much so. He was a fantastic drummer. Really incredible.

Q - Some contemporaries of Ringo have said he wasn't that good of a drummer.

A - They're just jealous. (laughs) Ringo was always great. You see, Rock 'n' Roll drumming is not necessarily very difficult. He always had that feel on the very first day I saw him. He stuck out immediately. On the very first day, I may not have realized that it was the drummer who was holding that band together, but the band was just solid. Even thought his playing wasn't that "hot", Ringo was just incredible. He was really, really good.

Q - Pete Best was the drummer in The Beatles when you first heard them. How would you rate his drumming?

A - He was doing OK, but if you compare it to Ringo, he just did not have that swing. He just did not have that rock. He just didn't.

Full Interview: The Klaus Voormann Interview

An old poster of the Kaiserkeller Club with Rory Storm & The Hurricanes + The Beatles:

 

[Foxhound]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

It dabbles around the edges. Read Bob Spitz: The Beatles, it is more in depth on why they sacked Pete. It is NOT a one sentence answer, many factors were involved.

You're right. It was complex. Wikipedia gets into some of these reasons:

Reasons for Best's dismissal

Best (top left) on stage in Hamburg, with Sutcliffe and Harrison in 1961.Best was never told why he was dismissed from The Beatles, as the only reason Epstein gave was, "The lads don't want you in the group anymore".[45] It has been documented (notably in Cynthia Lennon's book John) that while Lennon, McCartney, and Harrison usually spent their offstage time together in Hamburg and Liverpool, writing songs or socialising, Best generally went off alone. This left Best on the outside, as he was not privy to many of the group's experiences, references, and in-jokes.[56]

On their first trip to Hamburg, The Beatles realised that the stage suits they wore could not stand up to the hours of sweating and jumping about on stage every night, so they all bought leather jackets, jeans and cowboy boots, which were much tougher. Best preferred to play in short sleeves, and so did not match the sartorial style of the group, even though he was later photographed wearing a leather jacket and jeans.[57] Lennon, McCartney, Harrison, and Sutcliffe were introduced to drugs in Hamburg. As they had to play for hours every night, they often took Preludin to keep themselves awake, which were given to them by German customers or by Astrid Kirchherr, whose mother bought them.[58] Lennon would often take four or five, but Best always refused to join in.[59][60]

Kirchherr asked The Beatles if they would mind letting her take photographs of them in a photo session, which impressed them, as other groups only had snapshots that were taken by friends. The next morning Kirchherr took photographs in a municipal park called "der Dom" which was close to the Reeperbahn, and in the afternoon she took them all—minus Best who decided not to go—to her mother's house in Altona.[61][62] Best was described by Dot Rhone—McCartney's girlfriend at the time, who later visited Hamburg—as being very quiet, and never taking part in conversations with the group.[63]

Best's popularity with fans was a source of friction, as many female fans considered Best to be the band's best-looking member.[64] It has been said that Epstein became exasperated with Best's refusal to adopt the mop-top-style Beatle haircut as part of their unified look, although Best later claimed that he was never asked to change his hairstyle. In a 1995 BBC Radio Merseyside interview, Kirchherr explained: "My boyfriend, Klaus Voorman, had this hairstyle, and Stuart [Sutcliffe] liked it very, very much. He was the first one who really got the nerve to get the Brylcreem out of his hair, and asking me to cut his hair for him. Pete Best has really curly hair, and it wouldn't work."[65]

Radio Merseyside presenter, Spencer Leigh, wrote a book chronicling Best's firing, suggesting that the other members, McCartney in particular, were jealous.[66] During the Teenagers' Turn showcase in Manchester, Lennon, McCartney and Harrison walked on stage to applause, but when Best walked on, the girls screamed.[64] Best was surrounded at the stage door afterwards by attentive females while the other members were ignored after signing a few autographs. McCartney's father, Jim McCartney, was present at the time and admonished Best by saying: "Why did you have to attract all the attention? Why didn't you call the other lads back? I think that was very selfish of you".[64] Mona Best's take on her son's sacking, as told to British television in 1963 with Pete by her side: "From the point of clash of personalties, well, probably that may be it because Peter did have a terrific fan club, you know, compared to the others. [Interviewer: "Too good looking perhaps, eh?"] I'll leave that for other people to say but from my point of view we haven't come here to sort of throw sticks and stones at the boys because there is no really hard feeling. There was at first, but it's just the way that it was done that has annoyed us. If it had been done a bit more straightforward it would have been more to the mark."[67] Martin was shocked that Epstein had sacked Best: "He seemed to be the most salable commodity as far as looks went. It was a surprise when I learned that they had dropped Pete. The drums were important to me for a record, but they didn’t matter much otherwise. Fans don’t pay particular attention to the quality of the drumming".[68] Martin used session musician Andy White on the third session for "Love Me Do" on 11 September, and not Starr, who was Best's replacement.[69]

Though sometimes overshadowed by the "handsome debate", musically Best has been judged to have had a limited rhythmic vocabulary that was seen as holding the other three band members back from their collective musical growth. George Martin, as noted above, deemed Best's drumming to be inadequate for a record. As stated in Bob Spitz's 2005 biography, "All Pete could do was play 'Fours'..." a style of drumming that uses kick drum notes on every quarter note to hold down the beat. Spitz's book also contains engineer Ron Richards' account of his failed attempts to teach Best somewhat more complicated beats for different songs.[42] Critic and Beatles historian Richie Unterberger described Best's drumming at the Decca session as "thinly textured and rather unimaginative"[37] and said that Best "pushes the beat a little too fast for comfort".[38] Unterberger thought Ringo Starr to be "more talented."[70] Beatles critic Alan W. Pollack compared the Best, Starr, and Andy White versions of "Love Me Do" and concluded that Best was "an incredibly unsteady and tasteless drummer" on his version.[71]

All the other Beatles have offered allegations against Best that, they claim, culminated in his dismissal. Paul McCartney said that "it was a strictly professional decision. If he wasn't up to the mark...then there was no other choice". He also pronounced Best to be "a bit limited." On the other hand, McCartney told his daughter Mary for his Wingspan documentary, "We had Pete Best, who was a really good drummer, but there just was something, he wasn't quite like the rest of us. We had kind of a sense of humor in common and he was nearly in with it all. But it's a fine line, you know, as to what is exactly in and what is nearly in."[72] Lennon called the 'handsome debate' a "myth", claimed that Best only got in the band because the Beatles needed a drummer to go to Hamburg, and said, "We were always going to dump him when we found a decent drummer." Harrison said that "Pete kept being sick and not showing up for gigs" and claimed that he talked Lennon and McCartney into sacking Best. For his part, Ringo said that "I felt I was a much better drummer than he was."[73]Beatles authority Mark Lewisohn has concluded that "Despite his alleged shortcomings, it was still shabby treatment for Pete... the most underhand, unfortunate and unforgivable chapter in the Beatles' rise to monumental power."[74]

It should be noted that Lennon, McCartney and Harrison have also since apologized publicly, after a fashion, for the manner in which they sacked Best. Lennon admitted that "We were cowards when we sacked him."[75] McCartney has stated that "I do feel sorry for him, because of what he could have been on to."[76] Harrison said "We weren't very good at telling Pete he had to go"[77] and "Historically it may look like we did something nasty to Pete and it may have been that we could have handled it better."[78] Only Ringo has remained unapologetic: "I never felt sorry for Pete Best. I was not involved."[79]

 

[Džedaj]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

Holly be Jesus! This is one of most detailed BOM reviews ever, and I'm amazed.
Being die-hard Beatles fan in these times is really rare thing and I'm grateful that there are still people that will keep good music going on and on. Beatles are one of my 10 fav bands and I'm more than satisfied with this BOM! Woohoo!

 

[Flower]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

Great Thread ....

 

[The Beatles]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

Holly be Jesus! This is one of most detailed BOM reviews ever, and I'm amazed.
Being die-hard Beatles fan in these times is really rare thing and I'm grateful that there are still people that will keep good music going on and on. Beatles are one of my 10 fav bands and I'm more than satisfied with this BOM! Woohoo!

Thanks a lot!!

 

[The Beatles]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

Great Thread ....

thanks! More to come!

 

[The Beatles]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

With The Beatles
Released: March 22 1963



The second beatles album, With The Beatles, was recorded in eight sessions, which were on July 18 and July 30, 1963, September 11, 12, and 30, October 3, 17, and 23.

The album was recorded in Abbey Road Studios, in London, in Studio two, and was mixed on August 21, September 30, October 23, 29-30, of 1963.

With The Beatles was produced by George Martin, engineered and mixed by Norman Smith, and the cover photo was taken by Robert Freeman.

As can be seen by the dates, the Beatles obviously took much more time with this album than they did with the rushed-release Please Please Me.

There were several different versions of With The Beatles, meaning that they have generally the same songs and were released close to the original.

Here are some different versions:

With The Beatles UK: Parlophone PMC 1206, March 22, 1963 (mono)
With The Beatles UK: Parlophone PMC 3045, April 26, 1963 (stereo)
Meet The Beatles US: Capitol T 2047, January 20, 1964 (mono)
Meet The Beatles US: Capitol ST 2047, January 20, 1964 (stereo)
The Beatles' Second Album US: Capitol T 2080, April 10, 1964 (mono)
The Beatles' Second Album US: Capitol ST 2080, April 10, 1964 (mono)

The album reached number one status in the UK, and stayed there for 21 weeks (9 Less than Please Please Me,) beginning on December 7, 1963.

Oddly, this album was only released four months after Please Please Me. With The Beatles was more of the same material as Please Please Me, but more clean cut and precise. However, this album also has George Harrison's first composition recorded by the beatles, Dont Bother Me. The song was well reviewed by critics.

The (now famous) album cover was shot in a dark corridor of a hotel in england. It used a very unique light/dark composition, and thus is one of the Beatles most famous covers.

A funny fact about this album is that the early presses misspelled "You Really Got A Hold On Me" as "You Really Gotta Hold On Me." The albums with this mistake on them are worth four times as much as the ones without.

Track Listing:

Side One:

It Won't Be Long (2:11)
All I've Got To Do (2:01)
All My Loving (2:06)
Don't Bother Me (2:26)
Little Child (1:45)
Till There Was You (2:14)
Please Mister Postman (2:34)

Side Two:

Roll Over Beethoven (2:44)
Hold Me Tight (2:29)
You Really Got A Hold On Me (3:00)
I Wanna Be Your Man (1:56)
Devil In Her Heart (2:25)
Not A Second Time (2:05)
Money (2:47)

Notable Tracks:










Thats it for With The Beatles!

My Rating: 8/10

Coming Soon!
Album Analysis: A Hard Days Night

 

[Groovy Man]

Re: The Beatles-- Band Of The Month-- June 2010

Love ''With The Beatles''...

My favorite tracks are...

All I've Got To Do
Not A Second Time
Don't Bother Me
I Wanna Be Your Man
Hold Me Tight
It Won't Be Long
All My Loving
Till There Was You

7 out of 8 of these songs are original songs. The covers from this album are top notch jobs. Great album.