KISS (Official Thread)
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rtbuck
Senior Member
^^^Awesome!
METALPRIEST
Senior Member
Good I wasn't the only one going overboard...yup Houston is one of those shows where it's like...you want to see them on top of their game??
Another would have to be ABC In Concert's Black Diamond...that's pretty bad ass as well. Peter would get some air time out of his arms...I mean he used to HIT HARD!! San Fransicso you can see this as well as the phenomanal Long Beach clip of Acrobat
rtbuck
Senior Member
No, You definitely weren't going overboard MP LOL! That whole first Kissology is unbelievable. I'm also partial to the Don Kirshner footage because that is what really put Kiss on the table for me. I had just gotten Rock & Roll Over & had no idea about the stage show or costumes. I dug the music because it was my first taste of hard rock but with seeing the Kirshner footage I now looked at them totally different than just having great songs. They were superstars/super heroes & there was no looking back after that!
METALPRIEST
Senior Member
That was an exciting time for sure, before MTV and all that. To get a glimpse of these guys whenever they were on TV...they were something to look forward to back then.
I will always love the Kirshner footage myself and I still remember watching it live in the moment like it was yesterday
Lynch
Here for the cookies and the tunes
Archie and the gang.
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METALPRIEST
Senior Member
^^ Very Cool!
METALPRIEST
Senior Member
With all the mixed feelings of The Elder (I Love it personally) I found this a bit interesting. PLus I thought it would be good to go with 70's Guy's post in regards to the worst metal albums of all time.
I never really thought that myself and in fact was Rolling Stone Magazine's first REAL praise of a KISS album.
Anyway from Bob Ezrin to Lou Reed...enjoy readin what I found.
Source Link Here
From KISSFAQ.com
"Music From 'The Elder'" Album Notes:
Produced by Bob Ezrin. Associate Producer Brian Christian. Recorded at Ace In The Hole Studio, Connecticut, March - July 1981, A & R Studios, New York City, New York, May 1981, Record Plant Studios, New York City, New York, May, July - September 1981, Ezrin Farm Studio & Sounds Interchange, Toronto, Canada, March & May 1981, by Brian Christian, Rick Hart, Robert Hrycyna and David Brown. Additional Engineering by Rob Freeman, Corky Stasiak and Kevin Doyle. Mixed at Manta Sound Studio, Toronto, Canada.
fanfare
Were any track to be singled out to illustrate the pomposity and absurdity of the "Elder" concept, this 1:22 Bob Ezrin and Paul Stanley composition would be it. With its medieval instrumentation and feel, the piece served as an interlude in the original track order of the album.
Just A Boy
Written by Bob Ezrin and Paul Stanley while working together in a small 8-track studio in Ontario with Bob playing drums. The concept between this piece is the protagonist of the plot, "feeling exempt from the responsibility of leadership because of his age" (KISS PR). In other notes concerning the storyline, the premise of the song is that the young hero, and indeed individuals, need to look inside themselves and take control of their destinies to, as the analogy goes, "steer their own ships" without looking for excuses not to do so. Several different experimental mixes of this song exist, including an odd version with a Bach "Toccata & Fuge" styled organ background. Several rehearsal takes show Paul to have had some issues with the falsetto in which the song is sung. According to Bob, they really should have stopped the whole project when they heard this resulting piece!
Odyssey
While KISS recorded the song before its writer Tony Powers recorded his version, it is still technically a cover. Tony was a songwriter in the employ of hit songwriters Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller. He later wrote and performed a comedy video piece, "Don't Nobody Move (This Is A Heist)," which included "Odyssey" and two other songs, the title track and "Midnight Trampoline." This would also be released as a record on Sony in 1984. Tony Powers has been rumored to have been the "?" in the classic 1960s garage band "? And The Mysterians" who had a hit with "96 Tears" (a song Paul Stanley's band Uncle Joe would perform). That band had also been signed to Cameo/Parkway records and had material produced by Neil Bogart. In the storyline this song represents the hero's knowledge "that there is something greater than one's self involved" (KISS PR). This song includes Alan Schwartzberg on drums and Gene had originally wanted to sing the piece with Paul only taking the lead vocal at the last moment.
Only You
While this song would be written by Gene Simmons, its concept seems more likely at home with the sort of things Paul would rap about in concert. It's about believing in yourself, in the context of the boy-hero, and accepting his destiny that he is the only one who can fight the powers of darkness.
Under The Rose
Early on during his career with KISS, Eric Carr would make an immediate impact adding to the creativity within the band. This song would begin with Eric Carr. Eric recalled his role in the writing of the song: "I had all the music exactly the way it is on the album. I then brought it to Gene, and he worked on the lyrics. I think Ezrin was involved in that too, but I don't remember at this point" (Dark Light, Spring '90).
Eric had chosen the song from a list of song titles that dealt with the plot of Gene's embryonic idea. With the challenge the boy-hero faces, the first step was for him to accept his destiny as he appeared before the Order Of The Rose. According to Eric, "It was supposed to be about the chant meetings, the oath that these people take in this ancient 'order.' So I just decided that might be something to work on. A lot of the stuff that I would play on my own when I play guitar kind of had an eerie kind of thing to it. I figured maybe I could handle that. I just went in and I fooled around with stuff. And I brought the finished track, musically, anyway, to Gene. That was it. I had a scratch vocal on it. No words. I could not do lyrics at that time" (KISS Neon Glow #1, 1992).
Dark Light
Ace's interesting "Don't Run," which he had written with Anton Fig, would be co-opted by Gene and Lou Reed to be representative of the fear being caused by the powers of chaos and destruction who revel in disorder. Contrary to popular belief, Anton Fig would not drum on the studio track in place of Eric Carr.
A World Without Heroes
This song evolved out of an idea piece that Paul stopped working on. Gene, however, liked the melody of the piece, rather than the sappy lyrics Paul had originally come up with for his song ("Every Little Bit Of My Heart"). Gene took parts of it and with Bob Ezrin revamped the piece into what would be the album's sole single released in the United States, "A World Without Heroes." The title would come from Lou Reed simply writing the title down, as an idea, on a piece of scrap paper that caught Gene's attention. According to sample artwork for the abandoned "Exposed II" video cassette (1992) a version of the song exists with Lou Reed on lead-vocals. The song would also be KISS' first full concept video, due to being an artistically shot performance piece ending with a tear from the Demon's eye. This is in contrast to the pseudo-live performance videos which the band had first used for promotional purposes in 1975 ("Shandi" is partially concept mixed with performance).
The Oath
Written by Paul Stanley, Bob Ezrin, and Tony Powers. According to Paul, "For whatever reason, I didn't seem able to hit the high notes full voice at that point and wound up singing some passages in falsetto, which is hardly to my liking at this point" (Box Set Liners). Comparing the album version with the one Ace would perform on "Fridays" live in early 1982, it would seem to indicate that Paul plays lead on the track and Ace's work wasn't used.
Mr. Blackwell
Oddly, in one plot synopsis for the "Elder," Mr. Blackwell is a Washington D.C. power broker "who turns out to be the story's villain, and the worldly representative of the Powers of Darkness" (KISS PR) who is holding hostage a world leader. This seems quite different than the character Gene and Lou Reed would write into the song, a character who seems almost Dr. Jekyll-ish.
Escape From The Island
Written by Eric Carr, Ace Frehley, and Bob Ezrin while jamming in the basement of Bob's house. Bob would play bass on the recording of the song. This would be KISS' first instrumental since the debut album in 1974. According to Eric the 2:50 instrumental "was a jam that me, Ace, and Bob Ezrin did. We got together at Bob's house jamming in his little studio room in his basement. They started pulling things together, and that's how that song came about" (Dark Light, Spring '90). This puts the track in a class of its own for not including either Gene or Paul on it, though it would return the use of sirens (in this case air raid versus fire sirens) on a "KISS" song. Initially the song would not be included on the Japanese version of "The Elder," and it was instead the B-side to "The Oath" released in that country as a single. The song would be included on the release of "Killers," in Japan the following year.
I
Written by Gene and Bob Ezrin, the song sums up the change in the boy as he learns to believe in himself. The 3:52 song includes one verse that has long been seen to be both a dig at Ace's lifestyle and a statement of Gene's personal philosophy: "Don't need to get wasted / It only holds me down / I just need a will of my own / And the balls to stand alone." Interestingly, this would be the last song until "Revenge" on which Gene and Paul would share lead vocals.
This song also includes Alan Schwartzberg on drums. According to Paul, "As far as 'I,' it is indeed Alan Schwartzberg on the drums. Alan was a well-known session player in NYC and Bob Ezrin our producer at the time felt Eric was not playing the sound with the feel that Bob felt it needed. One of the rules we have always tried to adhere to when we work with Bob is to give him final say. It avoids ongoing, endless and sometimes unresolved issues" (KISS Online - Paul Speaks). Gene has been somewhat more blunt in his explanation of Alan's involvement suggesting that Eric simply couldn't provide the desired feel so they used Alan. What is interesting is that Eric would play the song live on "Fridays," without any problems.
Following the end of the song, one of the remaining spoken-word parts closes the album. "Elder: Morpheus, you have been summoned here to offer your judgment of the boy. Do you still deem him worthy of the fellowship? Morpheus: I certainly do my Lord. As a matter of fact, I, I think you're going to like this one. He's got the light in his eyes. And, the look of a champion. A real champion."
I never really thought that myself and in fact was Rolling Stone Magazine's first REAL praise of a KISS album.
Anyway from Bob Ezrin to Lou Reed...enjoy readin what I found.
Source Link Here
From KISSFAQ.com
"Music From 'The Elder'" Album Notes:
Produced by Bob Ezrin. Associate Producer Brian Christian. Recorded at Ace In The Hole Studio, Connecticut, March - July 1981, A & R Studios, New York City, New York, May 1981, Record Plant Studios, New York City, New York, May, July - September 1981, Ezrin Farm Studio & Sounds Interchange, Toronto, Canada, March & May 1981, by Brian Christian, Rick Hart, Robert Hrycyna and David Brown. Additional Engineering by Rob Freeman, Corky Stasiak and Kevin Doyle. Mixed at Manta Sound Studio, Toronto, Canada.
fanfare
Were any track to be singled out to illustrate the pomposity and absurdity of the "Elder" concept, this 1:22 Bob Ezrin and Paul Stanley composition would be it. With its medieval instrumentation and feel, the piece served as an interlude in the original track order of the album.
Just A Boy
Written by Bob Ezrin and Paul Stanley while working together in a small 8-track studio in Ontario with Bob playing drums. The concept between this piece is the protagonist of the plot, "feeling exempt from the responsibility of leadership because of his age" (KISS PR). In other notes concerning the storyline, the premise of the song is that the young hero, and indeed individuals, need to look inside themselves and take control of their destinies to, as the analogy goes, "steer their own ships" without looking for excuses not to do so. Several different experimental mixes of this song exist, including an odd version with a Bach "Toccata & Fuge" styled organ background. Several rehearsal takes show Paul to have had some issues with the falsetto in which the song is sung. According to Bob, they really should have stopped the whole project when they heard this resulting piece!
Odyssey
While KISS recorded the song before its writer Tony Powers recorded his version, it is still technically a cover. Tony was a songwriter in the employ of hit songwriters Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller. He later wrote and performed a comedy video piece, "Don't Nobody Move (This Is A Heist)," which included "Odyssey" and two other songs, the title track and "Midnight Trampoline." This would also be released as a record on Sony in 1984. Tony Powers has been rumored to have been the "?" in the classic 1960s garage band "? And The Mysterians" who had a hit with "96 Tears" (a song Paul Stanley's band Uncle Joe would perform). That band had also been signed to Cameo/Parkway records and had material produced by Neil Bogart. In the storyline this song represents the hero's knowledge "that there is something greater than one's self involved" (KISS PR). This song includes Alan Schwartzberg on drums and Gene had originally wanted to sing the piece with Paul only taking the lead vocal at the last moment.
Only You
While this song would be written by Gene Simmons, its concept seems more likely at home with the sort of things Paul would rap about in concert. It's about believing in yourself, in the context of the boy-hero, and accepting his destiny that he is the only one who can fight the powers of darkness.
Under The Rose
Early on during his career with KISS, Eric Carr would make an immediate impact adding to the creativity within the band. This song would begin with Eric Carr. Eric recalled his role in the writing of the song: "I had all the music exactly the way it is on the album. I then brought it to Gene, and he worked on the lyrics. I think Ezrin was involved in that too, but I don't remember at this point" (Dark Light, Spring '90).
Eric had chosen the song from a list of song titles that dealt with the plot of Gene's embryonic idea. With the challenge the boy-hero faces, the first step was for him to accept his destiny as he appeared before the Order Of The Rose. According to Eric, "It was supposed to be about the chant meetings, the oath that these people take in this ancient 'order.' So I just decided that might be something to work on. A lot of the stuff that I would play on my own when I play guitar kind of had an eerie kind of thing to it. I figured maybe I could handle that. I just went in and I fooled around with stuff. And I brought the finished track, musically, anyway, to Gene. That was it. I had a scratch vocal on it. No words. I could not do lyrics at that time" (KISS Neon Glow #1, 1992).
Dark Light
Ace's interesting "Don't Run," which he had written with Anton Fig, would be co-opted by Gene and Lou Reed to be representative of the fear being caused by the powers of chaos and destruction who revel in disorder. Contrary to popular belief, Anton Fig would not drum on the studio track in place of Eric Carr.
A World Without Heroes
This song evolved out of an idea piece that Paul stopped working on. Gene, however, liked the melody of the piece, rather than the sappy lyrics Paul had originally come up with for his song ("Every Little Bit Of My Heart"). Gene took parts of it and with Bob Ezrin revamped the piece into what would be the album's sole single released in the United States, "A World Without Heroes." The title would come from Lou Reed simply writing the title down, as an idea, on a piece of scrap paper that caught Gene's attention. According to sample artwork for the abandoned "Exposed II" video cassette (1992) a version of the song exists with Lou Reed on lead-vocals. The song would also be KISS' first full concept video, due to being an artistically shot performance piece ending with a tear from the Demon's eye. This is in contrast to the pseudo-live performance videos which the band had first used for promotional purposes in 1975 ("Shandi" is partially concept mixed with performance).
The Oath
Written by Paul Stanley, Bob Ezrin, and Tony Powers. According to Paul, "For whatever reason, I didn't seem able to hit the high notes full voice at that point and wound up singing some passages in falsetto, which is hardly to my liking at this point" (Box Set Liners). Comparing the album version with the one Ace would perform on "Fridays" live in early 1982, it would seem to indicate that Paul plays lead on the track and Ace's work wasn't used.
Mr. Blackwell
Oddly, in one plot synopsis for the "Elder," Mr. Blackwell is a Washington D.C. power broker "who turns out to be the story's villain, and the worldly representative of the Powers of Darkness" (KISS PR) who is holding hostage a world leader. This seems quite different than the character Gene and Lou Reed would write into the song, a character who seems almost Dr. Jekyll-ish.
Escape From The Island
Written by Eric Carr, Ace Frehley, and Bob Ezrin while jamming in the basement of Bob's house. Bob would play bass on the recording of the song. This would be KISS' first instrumental since the debut album in 1974. According to Eric the 2:50 instrumental "was a jam that me, Ace, and Bob Ezrin did. We got together at Bob's house jamming in his little studio room in his basement. They started pulling things together, and that's how that song came about" (Dark Light, Spring '90). This puts the track in a class of its own for not including either Gene or Paul on it, though it would return the use of sirens (in this case air raid versus fire sirens) on a "KISS" song. Initially the song would not be included on the Japanese version of "The Elder," and it was instead the B-side to "The Oath" released in that country as a single. The song would be included on the release of "Killers," in Japan the following year.
I
Written by Gene and Bob Ezrin, the song sums up the change in the boy as he learns to believe in himself. The 3:52 song includes one verse that has long been seen to be both a dig at Ace's lifestyle and a statement of Gene's personal philosophy: "Don't need to get wasted / It only holds me down / I just need a will of my own / And the balls to stand alone." Interestingly, this would be the last song until "Revenge" on which Gene and Paul would share lead vocals.
This song also includes Alan Schwartzberg on drums. According to Paul, "As far as 'I,' it is indeed Alan Schwartzberg on the drums. Alan was a well-known session player in NYC and Bob Ezrin our producer at the time felt Eric was not playing the sound with the feel that Bob felt it needed. One of the rules we have always tried to adhere to when we work with Bob is to give him final say. It avoids ongoing, endless and sometimes unresolved issues" (KISS Online - Paul Speaks). Gene has been somewhat more blunt in his explanation of Alan's involvement suggesting that Eric simply couldn't provide the desired feel so they used Alan. What is interesting is that Eric would play the song live on "Fridays," without any problems.
Following the end of the song, one of the remaining spoken-word parts closes the album. "Elder: Morpheus, you have been summoned here to offer your judgment of the boy. Do you still deem him worthy of the fellowship? Morpheus: I certainly do my Lord. As a matter of fact, I, I think you're going to like this one. He's got the light in his eyes. And, the look of a champion. A real champion."
rtbuck
Senior Member
^^^^Cool write up! ^^^
I love the album but I wish they would have done more with it especially with Bob Ezrin still riding high from 'The Wall'. I think it should have been possibly a double album with maybe a booklet in the form of a comic book with lyrics to explain the story because I know I had no idea what the record was when I bought it. I just seen the name Kiss on the Cover & bought it. I had no idea a new album was coming out & man, I had no idea what to make of it on my first listen. It was confusing as hell to me especially with that direction because Metal in the Likes of Ozzy & Judas Priest were beginning to be the in thing. I love the album but really felt more should have been put into it to explain the story because I really think they could have had something there
I love the album but I wish they would have done more with it especially with Bob Ezrin still riding high from 'The Wall'. I think it should have been possibly a double album with maybe a booklet in the form of a comic book with lyrics to explain the story because I know I had no idea what the record was when I bought it. I just seen the name Kiss on the Cover & bought it. I had no idea a new album was coming out & man, I had no idea what to make of it on my first listen. It was confusing as hell to me especially with that direction because Metal in the Likes of Ozzy & Judas Priest were beginning to be the in thing. I love the album but really felt more should have been put into it to explain the story because I really think they could have had something there
rtbuck
Senior Member
I'm not sure if this was already posted here but as long as I'm thinking of 'Music From the Elder' here's Doro's cover of "Only You".
...and speaking of this song (& no I won't mention the sampling of this on Julez Santana's Rap song...whoops I just did mention it!) it actually pre-dates Kiss back to the days of Wicked Lester & even just before that when they were called Rainbow. The song was originally called "Eskimo Sun" before they reworked it for the Elder
...and speaking of this song (& no I won't mention the sampling of this on Julez Santana's Rap song...whoops I just did mention it!) it actually pre-dates Kiss back to the days of Wicked Lester & even just before that when they were called Rainbow. The song was originally called "Eskimo Sun" before they reworked it for the Elder
