DarkWishWall
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- Joined
- Dec 13, 2005
- Posts
- 49
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Apologies, you came across as a dumb American. And continue to: your reading comprehension is still terrible. Too much Kerrang!
1. I'm talking about the rave music that came after Britpop, I would have thought that was clear from my asking how it 'came from Britpop'. In order for something to have come from something else, you generally find it has to happen afterwards. It was a rhetorical question anyway, the point of which has been proven in your disability to answer the first two. Music does not have to sound like something to be influenced by it.
"But I can't see the link between Bob Dylan and the extreme end of the metal scene. And you still haven't explained it to me." - As I loathe Slipknot, I have never listened to any songs in great depth so I can't claim to spot Dylan's influence directly.
I don't enjoy repeating myself. I cannot discuss Dylan's influence on this band (who I consider the scum of the Earth) because I am completely unfamiliar with their material. I only know they are influenced by him because they said so themselves. Am I speaking goddamned Swahili?!
By the way, you never actually said it was scientifically impossible, but the attempt at sarcasm said as much. I have no idea about the rest of the extreme metal scene, I was referring to Slipknot only because the interview was with one of them.
2. "a structure that was developed and refined well before the mid-70s when Springsteen recorded "Born To Run"."
I disagree. Of course it had been developed and used tirelessly but I believe each generation reinvents song structure, otherwise it would sound exactly the same. The structure was not at the peak of its use by 1975 in my opinion, it was yet to be reinvented and experimented with more and more and Springsteen is a case in point. His bridges are universally influential. I personally see them as a dumbing down of Dylan's.
3. "Are you seriously saying that Springsteen invented the pause-before-it-kicks-back-in technique? And have you heard "Sometimes" lately?"
Am I hell as like. (I wasn't really getting at the pause, more the style of the middle eight. There's no pause on 'Born To Run's middle eight, so I would be comparing two different things) I am not claiming that Springsteen invented any of these things otherwise I'd be claiming he invented the whole pop song itself, wouldn't I? My point is that Springsteen is a wholly influential artist when it comes to pop songwriting technique, and his influence, direct or indirect, can be heard in much songwriting since. Saying 'Let's not worry about "indirect influence"' is ridiculous. It's like me saying 'Let's not worry about people who weren't influenced by him, forget them, because if you don't then my argument is completely asinine'. He stamped his mark on the history of popular music, influencing thousands. Some made it, some didn't. Kids in the seventies grew up listening to him, they grew up and made albums which other kids grew listening to, and they grew up and made albums... and so it goes. Springsteen stands out because he brought old fashioned rock 'n' roll values to an audience that it had been lost on up to that point.
And no, I haven't heard 'Sometimes' lately. I am forced to confess that my knowledge of Britney Spears' artistically baroque body of work is a little hazy. I just remember the flute (or whatever the hell it is) part because it's a nice Springsteenesque middle eight.
4. If you bought something that you knew was breathtakingly stupid, then you are breathtakingly stupid. I'm not being dragged into that other argument because I seriously doubt you could consider the teenaged idiolect lexis of Kerrang! without thinking 'What the **** is he talking about?'
5. So because Bon Jovi and Springsteen happen to share their place of origin and both sing about it that makes one influenced by the other? Your definition of the word 'musical influence' should be revised. No wonder you thought Bon Jovi were 'The one band' he had influenced, they're the only band in your post who are from New Jersey!
I fail to see how the personas of Bon Jovi and Bruce Springsteen are the same at all. One were a bunch of Latin American immigrants with a penchant for 'hard rock' and the other was a serious singer-songwriter with a musical and lyrical message. One is slightly more intellectually challenging than the other. Was your point that Bon Jovi 'borrowed' the New Jersey working class narrative device from Springsteen? If so, it's possibly true, but that is where our definitions differ: you think that if someone downright copies someone else that means they are 'influenced' by them, I believe that 'influence' is an obvious fondness for another artist, illustrated through the personal twist of their songwriting technique and/or lyrical technique.
1. I'm talking about the rave music that came after Britpop, I would have thought that was clear from my asking how it 'came from Britpop'. In order for something to have come from something else, you generally find it has to happen afterwards. It was a rhetorical question anyway, the point of which has been proven in your disability to answer the first two. Music does not have to sound like something to be influenced by it.
"But I can't see the link between Bob Dylan and the extreme end of the metal scene. And you still haven't explained it to me." - As I loathe Slipknot, I have never listened to any songs in great depth so I can't claim to spot Dylan's influence directly.
I don't enjoy repeating myself. I cannot discuss Dylan's influence on this band (who I consider the scum of the Earth) because I am completely unfamiliar with their material. I only know they are influenced by him because they said so themselves. Am I speaking goddamned Swahili?!
By the way, you never actually said it was scientifically impossible, but the attempt at sarcasm said as much. I have no idea about the rest of the extreme metal scene, I was referring to Slipknot only because the interview was with one of them.
2. "a structure that was developed and refined well before the mid-70s when Springsteen recorded "Born To Run"."
I disagree. Of course it had been developed and used tirelessly but I believe each generation reinvents song structure, otherwise it would sound exactly the same. The structure was not at the peak of its use by 1975 in my opinion, it was yet to be reinvented and experimented with more and more and Springsteen is a case in point. His bridges are universally influential. I personally see them as a dumbing down of Dylan's.
3. "Are you seriously saying that Springsteen invented the pause-before-it-kicks-back-in technique? And have you heard "Sometimes" lately?"
Am I hell as like. (I wasn't really getting at the pause, more the style of the middle eight. There's no pause on 'Born To Run's middle eight, so I would be comparing two different things) I am not claiming that Springsteen invented any of these things otherwise I'd be claiming he invented the whole pop song itself, wouldn't I? My point is that Springsteen is a wholly influential artist when it comes to pop songwriting technique, and his influence, direct or indirect, can be heard in much songwriting since. Saying 'Let's not worry about "indirect influence"' is ridiculous. It's like me saying 'Let's not worry about people who weren't influenced by him, forget them, because if you don't then my argument is completely asinine'. He stamped his mark on the history of popular music, influencing thousands. Some made it, some didn't. Kids in the seventies grew up listening to him, they grew up and made albums which other kids grew listening to, and they grew up and made albums... and so it goes. Springsteen stands out because he brought old fashioned rock 'n' roll values to an audience that it had been lost on up to that point.
And no, I haven't heard 'Sometimes' lately. I am forced to confess that my knowledge of Britney Spears' artistically baroque body of work is a little hazy. I just remember the flute (or whatever the hell it is) part because it's a nice Springsteenesque middle eight.
4. If you bought something that you knew was breathtakingly stupid, then you are breathtakingly stupid. I'm not being dragged into that other argument because I seriously doubt you could consider the teenaged idiolect lexis of Kerrang! without thinking 'What the **** is he talking about?'
5. So because Bon Jovi and Springsteen happen to share their place of origin and both sing about it that makes one influenced by the other? Your definition of the word 'musical influence' should be revised. No wonder you thought Bon Jovi were 'The one band' he had influenced, they're the only band in your post who are from New Jersey!
I fail to see how the personas of Bon Jovi and Bruce Springsteen are the same at all. One were a bunch of Latin American immigrants with a penchant for 'hard rock' and the other was a serious singer-songwriter with a musical and lyrical message. One is slightly more intellectually challenging than the other. Was your point that Bon Jovi 'borrowed' the New Jersey working class narrative device from Springsteen? If so, it's possibly true, but that is where our definitions differ: you think that if someone downright copies someone else that means they are 'influenced' by them, I believe that 'influence' is an obvious fondness for another artist, illustrated through the personal twist of their songwriting technique and/or lyrical technique.
