I recently conducted an interview with Allan Kozinn, author of GOT THAT SOMETHING, currently available only as an ebook. Mr. Kozinn has been with the New York Times since 1977, and is currently a cultural reporter. Over the years, he has been assigned to cover The Beatles and their various projects, and has conducted interviews with Paul McCartney and Ringo Starr on multiple occasions, as well as other principals like George Martin, Neil Aspinall, Yoko Ono, Olivia Harrison, and many others associated with The Beatles in some way. Given the format of his book was digital, I decided to do the interview in email form.
JS: So, in case someone is reading this interview that wasn't aware of your book, tell us what it is about?
AK: Well, the main focus is "I Want To Hold Your Hand," the single that basically opened the door of the US market to the Beatles. People say that if that song hadn't, another would, and I suppose to an extent that's true - but keep in mind, "Please Please Me," "From Me To You" and "She Loves You" - even "She Loves You," which was huge in the wake of "I Want To Hold Your Hand" - were released in the US on small labels and did nothing. And you can't even attribute the success of "I Want To Hold Your Hand" to Capitol's marketing because as I show in the book, it took off almost in spite of Capitol Records. Capitol had planned to release it in mid-January 1964, but were forced to release it early because radio stations were playing the British release. Capitol actually tried to get them to stop playing it.
At any rate, though, the song is just a part of the story I'm telling here. I do talk about how it was written and recorded -- and the latter is significant, because it was the Beatles first four-track recording. I talk about the ramifications of recording technology for them, and in fact, I give a quick history of their early recording career, going all the way back to the accidental recording made by the Quarry Men at the Woolton Fete on July 6, 1957, the day Lennon and McCartney met. I also cover the afterlife of the song - the Beatles own performances, and covers by other groups and singers, up to the present day.
JS: Do you have any recollection of the first time you heard "I Want To Hold Your Hand?" You would have been a pre-teen when it came out, right?
AK: Actually, I do. I was with my father and younger brother in Sears, at the end of December 1963. Apparently in those days, they weren't playing Muzak, at least not in that branch of Sears in Yonkers, New York. My memory is kind of vague - I was 9, and it was half a century ago - but I seem to recall having heard about the Beatles but not having heard them, so when it came on, I was very curious. "So THAT'S the Beatles." I can't remember much about what my reaction was, actually, I just remember finding it interesting.
JS: What research and interviews did you do especially for this project?
AK: Since this is really just an extended essay, and because I've been very familiar with this material for a very long time, I can't say I did a lot of new research. I did speak with Billy F. Gibbons, from Z.Z. Top, because I wanted to know what he had in mind when he recorded "I Want to Hold Your Hand" in 1968 - which was definitely not the optimal time to record a song like that. And I was lucky enough to get an advance of Mark Lewisohn's book directly from the author, and to run a few questions past him that I hadn't been able to find answers to. But this isn't really an interview-heavy book: writing it had a lot more to do with close listening to all the existing performances of the song, and several of its predecessors, and a great many cover versions - as well as a reconstruction of the four-track master tape and a few snippets of outtakes, and the handful of quite different mixes that have been released over the years.
JS: Based on listening to all that, do you think the Beatles chose the best take and/or arrangement of this song as the "official version?"
AK: Yes, from what I've heard, I have no complaints about the version they released. They were generally pretty good about choosing the right one, fascinating as the outtakes often are.
JS: You mentioned several cover versions. Which ones were your favorites?
AK: I really like the 1968 version that I talk about at the very start of the book, and again at the end - the sort of psychedelic blues version by Moving Sidewalks, a Texas blues band that, about a year after they made their version, evolved into Z.Z. Top. I also like the Baroque orchestration by Joshua Rifkin, in the Baroque Beatles Book, an ingenious and often quite funny album released in 1966. In a certain mood, I kind of like the Chipmunks version as well, just for sheer silliness.
JS: What did you learn in writing this that you didn't already know?
AK: One thing that had never struck me before is how briefly the Beatles kept the song in their repertoire. They recorded it on October 17, 1963. And they dropped it from their set after the North American summer tour, which ended on Sept. 20, 1964 - and given the sketchiness of the reporting about Beatles concerts at the time, and the fact that there's no recording of that final show, we don't even know whether they actually played it at that last date. The strange thing is, whenever they had a reason to drop one song - for example, when the crowd in Vancouver proved so rowdy that the truncated the show slightly - the one song they dropped was "I Want To Hold Your Hand."
JS: Why do you think that was?
AK: Interesting question. In the book, I follow the early songwriting career of Lennon and McCartney, and I show -- and this was another thing I hadn't really thought that much about - that this song was in some ways a summing up of areas they had explored in their first four singles, and also the last song of the "early" period. Their method, at that time, was to keep the songs personal, with an emphasis on "me" and "you" -- that is, they were singing as if their songs were meant to be sung directly to the young girls who were their biggest (and loudest and most demonstrative) fans. But "I Want to Hold Your Hand" was huge in a way that was new for them. It sold a million copies in pre-orders in the UK, and though they soon got used to that, it was something new at the time. It went to the top of the charts in the US as well - a market they were worried that the wouldn't be able to crack. It really was the song that made them global superstars, and with that status, they realized that the audience was no longer composed mainly of young girls, but of everyone, over a bigger age spectrum than had previously been the case. And that liberated them: it let them escape the "me-you" expectations of the early singles, and turn to more mature material. Their next single, "Can't Buy Me Love" still has "me" and "you" in the lyrics, but it's a very different kind of song. And so was everything they did after that.
I believe that by the summer of 1964, they were beginning to see "I Want To Hold Your Hand" as a bit dated, in terms of their own ambitions and direction. So they put it behind them - along with all their early songs, with the sole exception of "I Wanna Be Your Man," which they continued to play live as late as 1966. But that was because it was a vehicle for Ringo, and what he wanted to sing on that tour, not because they thought it was a great song.
JS: How did you target what you were writing--for the novice or for the person that has read dozens of Beatles books?
AK: I don't know that I think in terms of targets. I meant it to be a book that anyone could get into, and come away with something fresh. But I was also hoping that people who do know a lot about the Beatles - who are a lot of my friends, after all - would read it and feel it was worth their while. So far, I've had very positive comments about it from Mark Lewisohn, Walter Everett, Richard Buskin and Mitch Axelrod, all Beatles authors I greatly respect, and who certainly know more than most people about "I Want To Hold Your Hand."
To be continued:
JS: So, in case someone is reading this interview that wasn't aware of your book, tell us what it is about?
AK: Well, the main focus is "I Want To Hold Your Hand," the single that basically opened the door of the US market to the Beatles. People say that if that song hadn't, another would, and I suppose to an extent that's true - but keep in mind, "Please Please Me," "From Me To You" and "She Loves You" - even "She Loves You," which was huge in the wake of "I Want To Hold Your Hand" - were released in the US on small labels and did nothing. And you can't even attribute the success of "I Want To Hold Your Hand" to Capitol's marketing because as I show in the book, it took off almost in spite of Capitol Records. Capitol had planned to release it in mid-January 1964, but were forced to release it early because radio stations were playing the British release. Capitol actually tried to get them to stop playing it.
At any rate, though, the song is just a part of the story I'm telling here. I do talk about how it was written and recorded -- and the latter is significant, because it was the Beatles first four-track recording. I talk about the ramifications of recording technology for them, and in fact, I give a quick history of their early recording career, going all the way back to the accidental recording made by the Quarry Men at the Woolton Fete on July 6, 1957, the day Lennon and McCartney met. I also cover the afterlife of the song - the Beatles own performances, and covers by other groups and singers, up to the present day.
JS: Do you have any recollection of the first time you heard "I Want To Hold Your Hand?" You would have been a pre-teen when it came out, right?
AK: Actually, I do. I was with my father and younger brother in Sears, at the end of December 1963. Apparently in those days, they weren't playing Muzak, at least not in that branch of Sears in Yonkers, New York. My memory is kind of vague - I was 9, and it was half a century ago - but I seem to recall having heard about the Beatles but not having heard them, so when it came on, I was very curious. "So THAT'S the Beatles." I can't remember much about what my reaction was, actually, I just remember finding it interesting.
JS: What research and interviews did you do especially for this project?
AK: Since this is really just an extended essay, and because I've been very familiar with this material for a very long time, I can't say I did a lot of new research. I did speak with Billy F. Gibbons, from Z.Z. Top, because I wanted to know what he had in mind when he recorded "I Want to Hold Your Hand" in 1968 - which was definitely not the optimal time to record a song like that. And I was lucky enough to get an advance of Mark Lewisohn's book directly from the author, and to run a few questions past him that I hadn't been able to find answers to. But this isn't really an interview-heavy book: writing it had a lot more to do with close listening to all the existing performances of the song, and several of its predecessors, and a great many cover versions - as well as a reconstruction of the four-track master tape and a few snippets of outtakes, and the handful of quite different mixes that have been released over the years.
JS: Based on listening to all that, do you think the Beatles chose the best take and/or arrangement of this song as the "official version?"
AK: Yes, from what I've heard, I have no complaints about the version they released. They were generally pretty good about choosing the right one, fascinating as the outtakes often are.
JS: You mentioned several cover versions. Which ones were your favorites?
AK: I really like the 1968 version that I talk about at the very start of the book, and again at the end - the sort of psychedelic blues version by Moving Sidewalks, a Texas blues band that, about a year after they made their version, evolved into Z.Z. Top. I also like the Baroque orchestration by Joshua Rifkin, in the Baroque Beatles Book, an ingenious and often quite funny album released in 1966. In a certain mood, I kind of like the Chipmunks version as well, just for sheer silliness.
JS: What did you learn in writing this that you didn't already know?
AK: One thing that had never struck me before is how briefly the Beatles kept the song in their repertoire. They recorded it on October 17, 1963. And they dropped it from their set after the North American summer tour, which ended on Sept. 20, 1964 - and given the sketchiness of the reporting about Beatles concerts at the time, and the fact that there's no recording of that final show, we don't even know whether they actually played it at that last date. The strange thing is, whenever they had a reason to drop one song - for example, when the crowd in Vancouver proved so rowdy that the truncated the show slightly - the one song they dropped was "I Want To Hold Your Hand."
JS: Why do you think that was?
AK: Interesting question. In the book, I follow the early songwriting career of Lennon and McCartney, and I show -- and this was another thing I hadn't really thought that much about - that this song was in some ways a summing up of areas they had explored in their first four singles, and also the last song of the "early" period. Their method, at that time, was to keep the songs personal, with an emphasis on "me" and "you" -- that is, they were singing as if their songs were meant to be sung directly to the young girls who were their biggest (and loudest and most demonstrative) fans. But "I Want to Hold Your Hand" was huge in a way that was new for them. It sold a million copies in pre-orders in the UK, and though they soon got used to that, it was something new at the time. It went to the top of the charts in the US as well - a market they were worried that the wouldn't be able to crack. It really was the song that made them global superstars, and with that status, they realized that the audience was no longer composed mainly of young girls, but of everyone, over a bigger age spectrum than had previously been the case. And that liberated them: it let them escape the "me-you" expectations of the early singles, and turn to more mature material. Their next single, "Can't Buy Me Love" still has "me" and "you" in the lyrics, but it's a very different kind of song. And so was everything they did after that.
I believe that by the summer of 1964, they were beginning to see "I Want To Hold Your Hand" as a bit dated, in terms of their own ambitions and direction. So they put it behind them - along with all their early songs, with the sole exception of "I Wanna Be Your Man," which they continued to play live as late as 1966. But that was because it was a vehicle for Ringo, and what he wanted to sing on that tour, not because they thought it was a great song.
JS: How did you target what you were writing--for the novice or for the person that has read dozens of Beatles books?
AK: I don't know that I think in terms of targets. I meant it to be a book that anyone could get into, and come away with something fresh. But I was also hoping that people who do know a lot about the Beatles - who are a lot of my friends, after all - would read it and feel it was worth their while. So far, I've had very positive comments about it from Mark Lewisohn, Walter Everett, Richard Buskin and Mitch Axelrod, all Beatles authors I greatly respect, and who certainly know more than most people about "I Want To Hold Your Hand."
To be continued:
