Big 80's Production = Less Intelligence??

METALPRIEST

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Thought this would make for a good topic. Some people talk about the 80's sound...the BIG LUSH 80's sound as if it were a bad thing. Now we're not just talking about metal bands...or as they were named hair bands later.

61151541_640.jpg

BUT....ANY band...classic bands even from the 60's and 70's like Jefferson Airplane or HEART. Speaking of HEART....this is what got me to write this thread. I was listening to "BAD ANIMALS" this week.....with all it's lush 80's production...and you know what?? I like it better than the last two albums that were more basic and blusier.

Do we really think that these type of albums, bands FROM that time...or bands that dabbled in the production styles all together were lazy?? Was it really an easy way out?? Cause from where I was sitting "Bad Animals" was pretty awesome. My point is.....it still takes just AS MUCH creative genius, talent and know how along with feeling...to make those style of albums.

One good track from the Bad Animals album that still blows me away is "Wait For An Answer"




Does stripping all this away and making the music more basic...or less hooky make it better or more intelligent?? There are some fans of music that think so. There are prog fans that think so...and IMO...a lot of prog is some of the most over produced and overly overdubbed music out there.

I Love Prog by the way, so that will not be the debate. But what is is shift in style or the bands that came out with the big sound straight away. Also is there a bit of prejudice from the strip down fan club against bands like Warrant when they made albums like Belly To Belly....which would be heavier, darker and lacking that big 80's sound.

Go ahead and discuss...and if you care to...post other big lush 80's production tunes that are worth value and show just as much and sometimes more intelligence than their stripped down counterparts and critics.

KEEP IT FUN
 

Magic

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For the most part I loved the 80's because of the Lush Production. I see nothing wrong with overdubbing & synths to make the sound perfect to the ears. I also see nothing wrong with auto-tune (but that is another discussion;)). New Wave, which got its beginnings in the 80's, was all about synths.

The 80's was about sound and image. Some of the best bands were popularized in the 80's: Queen, Def Leppard, Poison, Guns n Roses, Van Halen. All these bands had awesome production. I loved the 80's guitar driven music and the ballads.

Ballads........you can't have a good ballad with out having a lush sound. Right??


One of my favorite 80's musicians who used alot of synths is Stevie Wonder....would you dare to call him lazy?


Rush...who frequently used synths and lush production had some extremely popular songs, and they have a ton of fans. Are they lazy? I don't think so. They could synth some great bass that would melt your teeth!

This song comes to mind when I think of Rush, the 80's, and a lush production:

The Spirit of Radio



And here is some lush bass:

Red Barchetta



I think the 80's was very creative and these sounds are making a comeback :D



My main gripe against the 80's is concerts. The perfect lush production of the albums made the sound of a concert somewhat a disappointment. But I wasn't too disappointed........there is nothing more exciting than seeing your fav bands live.
 

METALPRIEST

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Yup that was my point....it was all very creative. Good posts there too. I mean I understand that the transition even from Airplane to Starship was rough on some people...but I for one do not believe something like this took less skill or had less talent than say .....Somebody To Love or White Rabbit

 

AboutAGirl

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Nothing to do with intelligence or laziness for me, I just don't enjoy that particular sound. Far from lazy, I reckon it takes much more time to produce one of those big 80s ballads with lush production than it does to make the rough, laissez-faire three-chord guitar, bass & drum production that I strongly favor.

Here's my idea of perfect production. It's bright, it's clean, it's well-recorded, but it's sparse, it's low maintenance, it lets the music breath. Nothing against anything else, that's just what my preference is for.

 

Magic

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Yup that was my point....it was all very creative. Good posts there too. I mean I understand that the transition even from Airplane to Starship was rough on some people...but I for one do not believe something like this took less skill or had less talent than say .....Somebody To Love or White Rabbit

Big production doesn't have to mean complexity. Big production was well on it's way even before the 80's, MP. Look at Atlanta Rhythm Section, for example, they had some really cutting edge music. They were hot in the late 70's. I don't think anyone thought they were lazy or put out music that wasn't intelligent.

Imaginary Lover




Nothing to do with intelligence or laziness for me, I just don't enjoy that particular sound. Far from lazy, I reckon it takes much more time to produce one of those big 80s ballads with lush production than it does to make the rough, laissez-faire three-chord guitar, bass & drum production that I strongly favor.

Here's my idea of perfect production. It's bright, it's clean, it's well-recorded, but it's sparse, it's low maintenance, it lets the music breath. Nothing against anything else, that's just what my preference is for.


I can recite an example of some simple music, that took a huge change in production.........ZZ Top. They went from gritty & raw, to slick production. The label change on the 1979 Deguello album totally changed the sound. Some people really gave some negative criticism over this, they wanted back that rawness and grit. But I honestly dont think the new production made ZZ Top any less creative.
 

AboutAGirl

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I agree, it definitely didn't make them any less creative. Honestly I'm not sure where that idea comes from. People might not have liked it but that doesn't mean they think it's less creative. I just think in the 80s a lot of rock bands started into disco, dancier music, more electronic music and just styles that rock fans aren't as interested in, so some people didn't like it as much. Not saying they're right about it, just saying I think that's where they're coming from: not that it's less creative, just that they don't like it.

Plus the other aspect is, a lot of these great rock bands were entering their second decade by then. The greatest bands can be good forever but a lot of bands run out of steam after so many albums, or casual fans just lose interest after a while. So that probably makes it look like more people disliked what was going on than really did, fans may have been leaving for reasons that had nothing to do with the style of the music.

Magic's right though, there's also an appreciation for that style and in hindsight a lot of people love it more than they might have at first.
 

Magic

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Yep! Rock fans (and metal fans) can be fickle.


It's like AOR gets dogged on. Why? I personally have never been able to clearly define AOR. How can I speak negative about something I can't define. I have a hard time separating AOR from big production.

:dunno:


I have a problem with techno/house/dance only for the reason of sound sampling and duplication. Same beat over and over. This does lose it's creativity for me. But when you're in a club having a good time, who cares, as long as you can dance to it, right?
 

Khor1255

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That 'lush' 80s sound came off as so contrived because it was contrived. In the 60s there was the wall of sound and other things that made production really lush and filled the 'empty air' that might have been allowed onto a recording but at least the contrivance there was a result of musicians rather than producers getting heavy handed in the studio.

I admit to enjoying some studio tinkering even some that is barely reproducible live. But studio tinkering like what happened with Hendrix, Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin etc is a far cry from just some 'radio friendly' injection of noise to soften out the rough edged of rock. Without these rough edges it just doesn't sound like rock at all to me. More like adult contemporary or flat out commercial jingelism.
 

gcczep

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...what was that?

...I saw the 1980's as a boon for the hairspray companies, liipstick for all sexes, pastel fashion/ruffles and Madonna. Everyone seems to be eithe pouting, sulking or both. I don't remember much of it but I do look back. It sounded slick, image conscious and homogeonized. There was some talent so I am not condemning ALL of it. Just seem scrubbed to the point of being too clean.

...then Guns 'N Roses happened.
 
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Khor1255

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...I saw the 1980's as a boon for the hairspray companies, liipstick for all sexes, pastel fashion/ruffles and Madonna. Everyone seems to be eithe pouting, sulking or both. I don't remember much of it but I do look back. It sounded slick, image conscious and homogeonized. There was some talent so I am not condemning ALL of it. Just seem scrubbed to the point of being too clean.

...then Guns 'N Roses happened.
I would agree with this but actually didn't feel like I was anywhere near out of the woods until I heard:

 

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