Honor and Sportsmanship...have we lost it?

[Dave78]

Originally Posted by Mr. Shadow Contador was booed loudly for several days after acting like a slime ball. He totally lacked class by attacking the Yellow Jersey with a mechanical failure. You just don't do that. Now he will never know if he was the better rider this year.

I only heard mixed reaction from the crowd during the podium celebration on that one day in question.

I didn't want to believe Contador at first when he said he didn't know Schleck had a "mechanical", but after watching the replays a few times it is apparent that Schleck had sat back down on his seat as Contador rode past him. How was Cantador to know it was because of a derailed chain and not just Schleck backing off on his attack?

Had Schleck already dismounted his ride to re-chain his bike as Contador was riding past him then, yes, you could cry foul, but that wasn't the case.

I feel terrible for Andy, but I don't think Contador's win is tainted one bit.

But I did thoroughly enjoy Phil and Paul arguing about it in the booth the next day.

On topic: I have read a few autobiographies over the last few years from notable sports figures and the one common theme is that dignity and team loyalty went out the window back in the 70's and 80's with free agency, arbitration, personal managers and big money. Even owners like Charlie Finley and George Steinbrenner are guilty.

Of course steroids are another issue altogether that has decimated the integrity of sports. All sports it seems.

And Pete Rose should be in the HOF. He got screwed by Bart Giamatti, imo. I know, I know... lying to the Commish about betting on baseball was wrong...

[Lord Grendel]

Originally Posted by Mr. Shadow Contador was booed loudly for several days after acting like a slime ball. He totally lacked class by attacking the Yellow Jersey with a mechanical failure. You just don't do that. Now he will never know if he was the better rider this year.

I have to agree, he tried to tell everyone he "Didn't Know" about Andy's problem and that is a humongous pile of horse shite, hell Andy was pulling ahead of him when he had the mechanical problem, and Contador was only a few meters behind him. For him to say he didn't realize it really was pathetic considering he rode right past him on that climb while Schleck waited for his mechanics.

On the other hand, I do give Contador a little credit for not trying to pass Schleck on the last climb in the Pyrenees, Andy's team pulled the pelaton most of the day, and lead up the last climb and then Schleck took it from there. I do think Alberto could have tried to pass him at the finish line but showed some class and just let the more deserving rider win the stage.

I do hope someone else wins it next year, and now I am waiting for the inevitable list of disqualifications from the race, it's usually a few days later that they start disclosing the results of failed drug/doping tests.

[taha]

Originally Posted by aeroplane To be crude about it, I am damn sick and tired of seeing "new" teams crop up every frigging year. It is either expansion or a team switching cities and I just can't keep up with it anymore. It is constant. You can't even go a lousy year or two it seems without something changing as far as the list of cities and teams in the league. You don't see the NBA or NFL constantly moving teams or introducing expansion teams..

don't know if I agree w/ this completely living near Houston. We have waited for the NHL for years, and since it's been a while for a new team we still wait. People forget the Stars moved some 10+ years ago and tho Columbus is new, they've been around for a while too. Compare that to the Minor League Texans or the move a lot Raiders, all leagues seem to balance out on changes. Houston should've had a NHL team before some of the others for the reason that the Aeros pulled an ave of 10-13k for years, that's more than the LAstos at times. And an NHL team w/ all the Yankee transplants in H town would have worked out very well.

[Lord Grendel]

^^I would have given Houston a team before Florida for sure Taha, and Nashville. At least Raleigh and Columbus support their teams but Gary Bettman is a disaster as commissioner. They should Never move teams from Canada to the sun belt, we at least will support them and add into that it's a gate driven league more than ever before just confirms that Winnipeg, Quebec City and Hamilton all deserve a team.(And Houston...)

[taha]

Originally Posted by Lord Grendel ^^I would have given Houston a team before Florida for sure Taha, and Nashville. At least Raleigh and Columbus support their teams but Gary Bettman is a disaster as commissioner. They should Never move teams from Canada to the sun belt, we at least will support them and add into that it's a gate driven league more than ever before just confirms that Winnipeg, Quebec City and Hamilton all deserve a team.(And Houston...)

Man the common sense of having teams in Canada is way beyond Bettmans brains. Don't all three of those now have at least an AHL team. They're good to build on ( for cities like Houston), but they could ALL support the NHL (again).
Only reason I mentioned Houston is its PROVEN success in hockey attendance w/ the Aeros for a sun belt team. Wouldn't have minded the Houston Preds !

[Lord Grendel]

^^Yes Houston has a good pedigree for hockey, they supported the Aeros in the WHA and from what you tell me there is a solid fan base in place.

Phoenix could be moved there no problem, that whole fiasco stains the entire league and Bettman in particular.

[Lord Grendel]

Alex Rodriguez hits his 600th home run yesterday in New York, one of the daily papers there published a sarcastic photo on the back page with an * and a comment about using performance enhancing drugs.

Personally I have no problem with that, there are so many of the big names tainted by the steroid HGH scandal I will never give them the accolades that the older players received for their accomplishments. Has anyone noticed the lack of home runs this year, and the amount of great pitching happening on a regular basis? Gives you something to think about doesn't it...

[Kuaizi]

Figure I'd chime in really quick. My favorite sport is basketball, and I grew up with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen. The games were so exciting, and MJ and Scottie took the sport very seriously and came to practice to work extremely hard to win. They elevated their teammates to new levels, and you can see the same qualities in the old teams like Bird's Celtics and Magic's Lakers.
I was pretty disgusted at the whole LeDouche *ahem* LeBron "Decision" crap he pulled, just so could announce he was going to South Beach to party and form a super team so he could win. Ohhh forget hard work and the fans and excitement you brought to Cleveland, I just want to put in the cheat codes and try to win as easy as possible.
Couple this with how horrible the officiating has been, the allstar treatment of the big names (to protect the big dollar players, which started towards the end of Jordan's career), and the constant travelling (uhhhh how did one and a half steps turn into 3 or 4?) and it's just not fun to watch anymore. Plus most of the stars these days have no honor, they are just punks and cry babies...
Sorry to rant and ramble, but it bugs me!
Anyways, sorry to ramble and rant

[Lord Grendel]

^^You can count me among the people that didn't watch LeBron's pitiful exercise in self indulgence, that has to be the biggest waste of a tv slot in modern sports history. What ever happened to the code of honor in sports in general, now it's about the money, the money and more money,,,,,,,and then trade me to a good team so I can win before I retire to count my....money. The athletes now are the most arrogant I have ever seen and it's part of the reason I don't really care about sports generally anymore.

[aeroplane]

I blame some of it on the media. The media culture now in the papers, on talk radio, on television and on the web belittles star players who have the nerve to go four or five years without winning a championship.

I don't look down any on LeBron for going seven years without winning a title in Cleveland, since he had a mostly piss poor cast around him. But everyone else in the country seemed to be belittling the guy to the point he had to find an easier way to a ring.

Granted, that doesn't excuse him from making a free agent decision on tv, but he shouldn't have had to leave town in the first place. But nobody in society seems to be willing to accept "failure" in sports and "failure" includes not getting any rings.

[Vic2010]

Good thread topic. I sort of skimmed over most of the posts but I read a few. Yes, honor and sportsmanship is lost in professional sports. It's been lost for years. Even in division one college sports it's gone. It's all because of money and personal gain (trophies, rings, etc.). It is what it is, and it'll never change. I'm sure in different types of sports and lower division college athletics there probably is sportsmanship (not sure about honor). I'd think that the last bastion of honor and sportsmanship would be the Olympics, but even in the Olympics there's doping. Sports is BIG business. I enjoy watching sports on TV but I'm not a sports troll by any stretch. Going to see a sporting event live is so expensive now that the average joe with a few kids is completely priced out. In the end it's just entertainment. I will however be following the NFL like a do every year.

[Foxhound]

I don't understand the complaints about sportsmanship being gone from the game. Just look at all the sports on this list:

1. Chicago Cubs outfielder Andre
Dawson on being a role model:

"I wan' all dem kids to do what I do, to look up to me. I wan' all the kids to copulate me."

2. New Orleans Saint RB George Rogers when asked about the upcoming season:

"I want to rush for 1,000 or 1,500 yards, whichever comes first."

3. And, upon hearing Joe Jacobi of the 'Skin's say: "I'd run over my own mother to win the Super Bowl,"

Matt Millen of the Raiders said: "To win, I'd run over Joe's Mom, too."

4. Torrin Polk, University of Houston receiver, on his coach, John
Jenkins:

"He treats us like men. He lets us wear earrings."

5. U.5. Football commentator and former player Joe Theismann:

"Nobody in football should be called a genius. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein."

6. Senior basketball player at the University of Pittsburgh:

"I'm going to graduate on time, no matter how long it takes."

7. Bill Peterson, a Florida State football coach:

"You guys line up alphabetically by height.."
And, "You guys pair up in groups of three, and then line up in a circle."

8. Boxing promoter Dan Duva on Mike Tyson going to prison:

"Why would anyone expect him to come out smarter? He went to prison for three years, not Princeton ."

9. Stu Grimson, Chicago Blackhawks left wing, explaining why he keeps a color photo of himself above his locker:

"That's so when I forget how to spell my name, I can still find my clothes."

10. Lou Duva, veteran boxing trainer, on the Spartan training regimen of
heavyweight Andrew Golota:

"He's a guy who gets up at six o'clock in the morning, regardless of what time it is."

11. Chuck Nevitt , North Carolina State basketball player, explaining to Coach Jim Valvano why he appeared nervous at practice:

"My sister's expecting a baby, and I don't know if I'm going to be an uncle or an aunt."

12. Frank Layden , Utah Jazz president, on a former player:

"I asked him, 'Son, what is it with you? Is it ignorance or apathy?'
He said, 'Coach, I don't know and I don't care.'"

13. Shelby Metcalf, basketball coach at Texas A&M, recounting what he told a player who received four F's and one D:

"Son, looks to me like you're spending too much time on one subject."

14. In the words of NC State great Charles Shackelford:

“I can go to my left or right, I am amphibious.”

15. Amarillo High School and Oiler coach Bum Phillips when asked by Bob Costas why he takes his wife on all the road trips, Phillips responded:

"Because she is too damn ugly to kiss good-bye."

[Lord Grendel]

^^ Very Illuminating Fox.

Back to the subject at hand...Aero I have nothing against LeBron's frustration with leaving Cleveland he did play for 7 years and try to win a title, but the Pathetic TV slot was embarrassing...after all Who really cares where a basketball player ends up? I know I don't and haven't for many years, probably since the Bird/Magic/Jordan era where team loyalty still meant something along with beating your best competitors not throwing in with them.

There are still some good characters in professional sports, but I have lost a lot of my passion for all of them over the last 15 years. The louder and more arrogant they become, the less interested I am in what they do. And has anyone else noticed the number of Felony charges over the last few years going through the roof? A product of the "Green Light" through school and college just because you can play a sport. I wonder how many of these successful athletes can even do simple math, know about world history and important events...not too many from what I've seen the last few years. Ask them for directions to the nearest strip club or casino and they know the answer no problem.

I will always cheer for the NE Patriots, Edmonton Oilers/Eskimos, but I don't live and die with my teams anymore and I used to be a passionate fan.

[Aktivator]

Originally Posted by Lord Grendel . The Honor in sports has slipped in my lifetime, no doubt about it at all. In football it's no longer about making a tackle, it's about decapitating someone on the field.

I would actually say football is a much more tame game today then at anytime in the past. The problem with football is after the play is made where its all about making ESPN highlights by dancing, finger pointing, some stupid jester etc. Back in the day they did everything including chop blocking, slamming the QB to the ground, heck the lineman beat the crap out of each other when they were on the ground.

In regards to baseball-there has never been a clean era. Baseball players have been cheating since the beginning of the game.

I say let them all do drugs heck I'm waiting for the day when sports are all robots.

[Lord Grendel]

^^Have to disagree with you AK, in fact this year for the first time ever the NFL is forcing teams and players to obey the concussion rule. There are countless thousands of retired college and professional football players who will be suffering for the rest of their lives for the wear and tear of playing the game they love. Until they come up with a new helmet or coach the players from Pop Warner to high school, college and the pros that leading with your helmet is not going to be acceptable anymore.

I have watched football since the 60's and of course there were always hard hits, but nothing on the scale of what we see in today's game. The object was supposed to be to tackle the guy hard, dust yourself off afterward go back to the huddle and run the next play. Now it's all about hitting them with the intent to injure at least that is my opinion.