Child-rearing in gender-neutral environments. - Page 2

Flower · 06-26-2010, 10:34 AM

Originally Posted by METALPRIEST

I voted Who gives a damn?

Mainly because I never really thought about it. I have a boy and a girl and my only concen has been them fighting over each other's things. "Who had it first", "Give that back", "Share"

I've seen my boy play with my daughter's dolls...my daughter wanting a toy jackhammer after my son wanting one ( we got her a smaller one she loves)...never told them (or made an issue over) what a girl or boy item was, or what supposedly belonged to who.

As far as clothes?? They both wear a variety of clothes along with a variety of colors. We never put our son in a dress..in our minds...that's up to him..as he gets older. But "boy" clothes have never been stressed, or talked about as something of great importance, nor has the topic that it's ok for boys to wear girl's clothes come up.

Those things you just have to wait on and see with no coaxing either way ...I do know this...they are my children...I love them now...and always will.

I'm totally with MetalPriest here.

I would like to add that parents should teach their kids everything that they can teach. By this, I mean that sons shouldn't be the ones to mow the lawn and daughters shouldn't be the ones to wash the dishes ... All household chores should be shared and learned. Teaching your children, regardless of sex, how to cook, clean and fix things will only help them in later life.

That being said ... Why stop there? Should people call their children only gender neutral names?

AboutAGirl · 06-26-2010, 04:13 PM

Fact: There are plenty of boys who play with dolls and girls who play with fire trucks.

Gender roles are proclivities at most. There can be no question that the possibility for eschewing them exists. So I say, raising kids gender-neutral will yeild neutral results at worst. It can't hurt.

I was never masculine for my first 17 or so years. Used to HATE masculinity. I'm vaguely masculine these days.

**Cosmic Harmony** · 06-26-2010, 07:59 PM

Originally Posted by Dave78

The only other situation that would be worse, I feel, would be to be raised by two gay parents. Because, imo, that's not a natural environment for a kid either.

Oh wow.... -_-' There is really so very much wrong with what you just said that I would probably break the character limit on my post if I wrong about how wrong it was.

So for sake of convenience I think it's best to just conclude that you're mistaken on an epic ****ing scale.

Anywho....

From my personal experience I was raised in a home that had tightly defined gender lines and my parents pushed "boy things" on me quite a bit. I of course was not thrilled about this and would have really appreciated a more gender neutral environment.

**Lynch** · 06-26-2010, 08:48 PM

Opinion overload here. I could write a short novel on my thoughts on this topic, but I do not want to do that.

here's my very quick/fast thoughts on it. There is ZERO possible way to raise a kid from birth on up to the ripe old age of 18 in a truly "gender neutral" environment, unless you live in a shack in the mountains where you see no other people, ever. You have no TV, you have virtually no reading materials. Both parents and ALL siblings where the exact same clothes. Either everyone in the family pisses standing up or everyone does it sitting down. Mom will need to shave daily to get the facial hair going and dad will need a nice set of fake tits.

C'mon. No offense to anyone who thinks about this sort of thing, nothing against Lady for starting the topic, no offense to anyone who is totally for OR against the idea. I just don't think this is possible. We are all born with a specific gender: male or female, excluding a fairly rare birth disorder where both (or parts of both) sex organs are in place. Being that we are born basically one of two ways, how can you live in a "neutral" environment?

Unless of course, if you live in that cabin up in the woods far from any sort of civilization. the minute you get into any sort of "normal" community, there is going to be non-neutral stuff everywhere you look. Go to McDonalds and need to go to the bathroom? How would you choose and furthermore, why would you even have to make that choice?

annie · 06-26-2010, 11:05 PM

^^^^ Agree

Odysseus · 06-26-2010, 11:45 PM

Originally Posted by Dave78

Kids don't need gender roles pushed on them. They develope those roles, attitudes and tendencies naturally. Wouldn't it also be considered a "poison" or "militant" for a parent to intentionally deny their child gender-specific clothing, toys or reading material?

There was a program on MSNBC a few years ago about some little boy who (I believe) had a botched circumcision so the doctors persueded the parents to allow them to perform a sex change on him. The parents then raised their boy as a girl with all the clothes, toys, etiquette, etc, and "she" still wanted to dress like a boy, climb trees and play sports. As "she" grew up, she always knew she was different, but it was never explained to her until she was an adult. What a mind-f***!

The bottom line is that kids know what they are, so if a parent is going to influence them, do it in a positive way. As a parent, I wouldn't play games with the kids' formative years for the sake of experimentation.

The only other situation that would be worse, I feel, would be to be raised by two gay parents. Because, imo, that's not a natural environment for a kid either.

I agree with Dave as well however, playing games with the kids formative years has seemingly taken over normal child rearing these days. There exists the destructive teaching of the "everybody is a winner" approach to sports and academics, regardless of their performance, that children aren't allowed to experience failure at its most human level. The lesson learned is vaporized and replaced with a hyperactive or sedate ego which eventually materializes in a twisted laziness/disrespect/destructive achievement toward themselves and their fellow man as they enter adulthood, relationships and beyond.

ladyislingering · 06-26-2010, 11:52 PM

Originally Posted by Lynch

Unless of course, if you live in that cabin up in the woods far from any sort of civilization. the minute you get into any sort of "normal" community, there is going to be non-neutral stuff everywhere you look. Go to McDonalds and need to go to the bathroom? How would you choose and furthermore, why would you even have to make that choice?

I kind of chuckled a little at this because it's like a severe blowing-out-of-proportion statement.

I don't mean LITERALLY or sexually. I meant, as far as gender roles go.

I don't mean completely blinding a kid to which sex they are. I mean, not purposely raising a little girl to think that she has to be a schoolteacher, a nurse, or a housewife, and not raising a little boy to think that he HAS to be a doctor, lawyer, or greasemonkey.

Sunny · 06-27-2010, 12:04 AM

There exists the destructive teaching of the "everybody is a winner" approach to sports and academics, regardless of their performance, that children aren't allowed to experience failure at its most human level. The lesson learned is vaporized and replaced with a hyperactive or sedate ego which eventually materializes in a twisted laziness/disrespect/destructive achievement toward themselves and their fellow man as they enter adulthood, relationships and beyond.

I agree with that in every way! It's fine to have a child grow up with self esteem but this attitude of protecting a child from failure and praising every aspect of school work and behaviour certainly shows up in later years when the grown child starts real life out in the workplace and all that praise is gone ....... the latest thing for young people to be "suffering" from these days is anxiety and depression because ...... guess what .......... life is tough and the days of pats on the head are long gone.

Apologies for de-railing the topic.

TheFeldster · 06-27-2010, 12:27 AM

I'm going to have to agree with Odysseus and Sunny here.

I remember there was a small controversy here because at a primary school soccer match, one team lost 16-0. The coaches and parents refused to tell the kids involved what the score was, for fear of upsetting the losing team.

They're gonna have to learn that sooner or later, anyway, why shield them in the first place

troggy · 06-27-2010, 12:40 AM

Originally Posted by TheFeldster

I'm going to have to agree with Odysseus and Sunny here.

I remember there was a small controversy here because at a primary school soccer match, one team lost 16-0. The coaches and parents refused to tell the kids involved what the score was, for fear of upsetting the losing team.

They're gonna have to learn that sooner or later, anyway, why shield them in the first place

When this topic comes up with my brother, he remembers his pee-wee baseball team that lost a game by the score of 42-2.

troggy · 06-27-2010, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by ladyislingering

I mean, not purposely raising a little girl to think that she has to be a schoolteacher, a nurse, or a housewife, and not raising a little boy to think that he HAS to be a doctor, lawyer, or greasemonkey.

Most parents haven't been doing that for quite a number of years now. This isn't 1955.

ladyislingering · 06-27-2010, 12:44 AM

Originally Posted by troggy

Most parents haven't been doing that for quite a number of years now. This isn't 1955.

You'd be surprised the crazy shit the education system managed to pull up here during the early 90's.

troggy · 06-27-2010, 12:48 AM

Originally Posted by ladyislingering

You'd be surprised the crazy shit the education system managed to pull up here during the early 90's.

Nothing the education system does surprises me.

ladyislingering · 06-27-2010, 12:51 AM

Originally Posted by troggy

Nothing the education system does surprises me.

When I was in high school, my class had to undergo a career unit of some sort. One of the deciding factors through the computerized assessment was gender. I never really thought about it then, but I was rather frustrated to find that when I set out to interview a newspaper editor, my teacher at school told me that it wasn't a fitting position for a young lady, and why wouldn't I like to be an RN, or a schoolteacher, or something ridiculous and gender-specific.

Then again I kind of grew up in an area where most people are sexist, racist, and just plain ignorant. If you ever asked "why can't I do that?" people are likely to say "because you're a woman, and women don't do that".

Sunny · 06-27-2010, 12:59 AM

my teacher at school told me that it wasn't a fitting position for a young lady, and why wouldn't I like to be an RN, or a schoolteacher, or something ridiculous and gender-specific.

For goodness sake I'm a nurse and 50% of nurses in the hopital are male. My male housemate is a teacher. Those professions are not gender specific. My girly twin sister is civil engineer.